Wyche: Rams getting Goff ready

[-X-]

It's amusing year after year to see people deflect blame onto other offensive players to absolve the under-performing QB. Hopefully, that will become unnecessary. when Goff becomes the starter.

Oh I'll continue to do it if I see Goff making good throws and receivers quitting on their routes or dropping balls or misreading sight adjustments. I wouldn't want Goff to get thrown under the bus by people who never wanted him drafted in the first place. And you can bet your life that'll happen too.

 

[blackbart]

How about points scored?

It's amusing year after year to see people deflect blame onto other offensive players to absolve the under-performing QB. Hopefully, that will become unnecessary. when Goff becomes the starter.

Yeah I hope so too. Just a little insight for you, points scored is not a QB stat

 

[jrry32]

Yeah I hope so too. Just a little insight for you, points scored is not a QB stat

There's technically no such thing as a QB stat. Points scored is connected to QB play. Less directly connected than passing yards but still connected.

 

[jrry32]

Oh I'll continue to do it if I see Goff making good throws and receivers quitting on their routes or dropping balls or misreading sight adjustments. I wouldn't want Goff to get thrown under the bus by people who never wanted him drafted in the first place. And you can bet your life that'll happen too.

Hopefully, it'll be unnecessary because Goff's positive plays will more than offset it.

 

[OldSchool]

One thing that is abundantly clear to me is the difference in coaching staff. Look at Philly their HC, OC and QB coach are all former QB's and experienced as coaches. Dallas HC former QB and OC, their OC started coaching in college almost 30 years ago and is a very experienced OC/QB coach. Wade Wilson is their QB coach an 18 year vet and 16 year coach. Go to the Rams we have Jeff Fisher a defensive coach with well we all know his reputation and past. Rod Boras a 24 year vet coach from offensive lines and tight ends. Our passing game coordinator a former QB who's mostly been a WR coach but with some QB coach experience. Our QB Coach is a former QB and this is his first year as a coach. The difference in coaching staff make up should shed light on why Wentz and Prescott have been able to play to the level they are so far. I can only wish that our coaching staff was set up to help a QB succeed.

 

[dieterbrock]

Yeah I hope so too. Just a little insight for you, points scored is not a QB stat

So what stat exactly do you stand by to support Keenum being starter worthy?
He turns the ball over often, the team doesn't score points with him at the helm, the team doesn't win more than half its games with him at QB and his passer rating is among the lowest in the league.
So what is the first line of defense? That the players around him aren't playing well?

 

[-X-]

One thing that is abundantly clear to me is the difference in coaching staff. Look at Philly their HC, OC and QB coach are all former QB's and experienced as coaches. Dallas HC former QB and OC, their OC started coaching in college almost 30 years ago and is a very experienced OC/QB coach. Wade Wilson is their QB coach an 18 year vet and 16 year coach. Go to the Rams we have Jeff Fisher a defensive coach with well we all know his reputation and past. Rod Boras a 24 year vet coach from offensive lines and tight ends. Our passing game coordinator a former QB who's mostly been a WR coach but with some QB coach experience. Our QB Coach is a former QB and this is his first year as a coach. The difference in coaching staff make up should shed light on why Wentz and Prescott have been able to play to the level they are so far. I can only wish that our coaching staff was set up to help a QB succeed.

I think there's some truth to that, but we don't know yet if this coaching staff is holding anyone back.
It's just a matter of them not wanting to start him until he demonstrates a certain level of knowledge and comfort.
Once he's in there, we'll have a better gauge of whether or not their coaching is up to snuff. Yeah?

 

[OldSchool]

I think there's some truth to that, but we don't know yet if this coaching staff is holding anyone back.
It's just a matter of them not wanting to start him until he demonstrates a certain level of knowledge and comfort.
Once he's in there, we'll have a better gauge of whether or not their coaching is up to snuff. Yeah?

Absolutely we won't know until he gets on the field for certain. My point was merely they were better set up to develop a QB in my mind with their coaching staff than the Rams are.

 

[dieterbrock]

Oh I'll continue to do it if I see Goff making good throws and receivers quitting on their routes or dropping balls or misreading sight adjustments. I wouldn't want Goff to get thrown under the bus by people who never wanted him drafted in the first place. And you can bet your life that'll happen too.

Well I'll give the QB who is hopefully going to be the QB for the next decade a mush longer leash (like I gave Bradford) than to a QB who is merely a placeholder/journeyman who is playing the way you would expect a placeholder/journeyman to play

 

[-X-]

Well I'll give the QB who is hopefully going to be the QB for the next decade a mush longer leash (like I gave Bradford) than to a QB who is merely a placeholder/journeyman who is playing the way you would expect a placeholder/journeyman to play

Well, sure. Why not. But I'm still gonna point out the good and bad just like I did with Keenum. He may have been in the league longer, but it's absolutely dumbfounding to me how everyone just ignores the fact that he's had 3 head coaches and 5 coordinators in his 22 starts. If that's not a big deal, then everyone should be okay if that's the developmental path Goff takes in his career too.

 

[-X-]

Absolutely we won't know until he gets on the field for certain. My point was merely they were better set up to develop a QB in my mind with their coaching staff than the Rams are.

Oh sure, I agree with that. On paper there's much more experience on that side of the ball.

 

[Selassie I]

It's not like Fisher hired a Heisman Trophy winning QB who was the Football Director at IMG Academy for 5 years to work with Goff.

Oh... wait...

That guy's name is Chris Weinke.


Just saying. We don't have chump ass coaches on this staff.

 

[dieterbrock]

Well, sure. Why not. But I'm still gonna point out the good and bad just like I did with Keenum. He may have been in the league longer, but it's absolutely dumbfounding to me how everyone just ignores the fact that he's had 3 head coaches and 5 coordinators in his 22 starts. If that's not a big deal, then everyone should be okay if that's the developmental path Goff takes in his career too.

I'm ok with watching a QB develop.
But I don't care to waste time developing Keenum at Goff and the team's expense
Keenum was supposed to prevent the "rookie" errors
So yeah, I'd rather be watching Goff have peaks and valleys at 3-4 than Keenum
What Keenum is learning will likely help his next team while Goff growing only helps the Rams

 

[OldSchool]

It's not like Fisher hired a Heisman Trophy winning QB who was the Football Director at IMG Academy for 5 years to work with Goff.

Oh... wait...

That guy's name is Chris Weinke.


Just saying. We don't have chump ass coaches on this staff.

So a guy in his 1st year equals a combined 40 years of NFL and college coaching? I'm not saying Weinke is a scrub but he's the only one with any QB coaching experience on the entire staff. They're not exactly equal here.

 

[-X-]

So a guy in his 1st year equals a combined 40 years of NFL and college coaching? I'm not saying Weinke is a scrub but he's the only one with any QB coaching experience on the entire staff. They're not exactly equal here.

Well, not entirely.

Groh is a former QB himself, and has some experience coaching QBs in the college ranks.
Weinke has been coaching (albeit not in the NFL) quarterbacks for 5 years and Cam Newton thought enough about him to accept his tutelage back in 2011.
[source]

 

[blackbart]

So what stat exactly do you stand by to support Keenum being starter worthy?
He turns the ball over often, the team doesn't score points with him at the helm, the team doesn't win more than half its games with him at QB and his passer rating is among the lowest in the league.
So what is the first line of defense? That the players around him aren't playing well?

The only one that matters, Fisher and the coaching staff think he give the team the best chance to win.

You can look up whatever you want, spin which ever story or stat line you want spew as much vile as you want and none of it matters.

Keenum has been the starting QB for the Rams in 2016 because he is the best option. His stats are not his alone just like every other QB if the other players are not doing their jobs well the QB won't look good either.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/K/KeenCa00.htm
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GurlTo01.htm
http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/drops/2016/

 

[OldSchool]

Well, not entirely.

Groh is a former QB himself, and has some experience coaching QBs in the college ranks.
Weinke has been coaching (albeit not in the NFL) quarterbacks for 5 years and Cam Newton thought enough about him to accept his tutelage back in 2011.
[source]

all of which I addressed in my initial post. But then this was posted ignoring what I said.

It's not like Fisher hired a Heisman Trophy winning QB who was the Football Director at IMG Academy for 5 years to work with Goff.

Oh... wait...

That guy's name is Chris Weinke.


Just saying. We don't have chump ass coaches on this staff.

Weinke is a nice addition but hardly equals what other teams are doing to ready young QB's. How much exactly is a Heisman worth in the NFL? How many Heisman winning QB's have success in the NFL? Lets see Mariota and Winston are each in their 2nd year so too early to tell. Manziel well yeah. Griffin the 3rd he's still playing when not hurt. Cam is great. We all know what Bradford is. Tim Tebow is in the Arizona Fall league relearning to play baseball. Troy Smith, Matt Leinart and Jason white hmmmmm. I'd say in the last 15 years the only 2 Heisman winning QB's to have any real success are Cam and Carson Palmer with 2 still too early to tell.

 

[dieterbrock]

The only one that matters, Fisher and the coaching staff think he give the team the best chance to win.

You can look up whatever you want, spin which ever story or stat line you want spew as much vile as you want and none of it matters.

Keenum has been the starting QB for the Rams in 2016 because he is the best option. His stats are not his alone just like every other QB if the other players are not doing their jobs well the QB won't look good either.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/K/KeenCa00.htm
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/G/GurlTo01.htm
http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/drops/2016/

Well that is the gist of it, its solely Fisher's call and I think its a mistake.
That has been what the discussion has been about.
Fisher thought he was going to get something out of Keenum that Goff couldn't get and Case has set a very low bar
No spin necessary, Keenum is arguably one of the worst starting QB in the league

 

[Selassie I]

My point was simple. Our coaching staff is not made up of a bunch of chumps.

We haven't seen what our coaches have been able to do with Goff yet. Key word... YET.

I'm ready as anyone else to see though. I'm just not going to trash the job the staff has done with Goff until I've had a chance to lay my eyes on it.

 

[blackbart]

Well that is the gist of it, its solely Fisher's call and I think its a mistake.
That has been what the discussion has been about.
Fisher thought he was going to get something out of Keenum that Goff couldn't get and Case has set a very low bar
No spin necessary, Keenum is arguably one of the worst starting QB in the league

I think they have done the best they could with the options available after picking Goff. The CBA limited what they could get done before the start of the season and he certainly didn't look ready, if anything he looked like an injury waiting to happen. I don't think Keenum is great but he isn't bad if he could get some help.

I'm more disappointed with Gurley than I am Keenum, I had much higher expectations for Gurley's production the Keenum's.