What to do with Gregg Williams?

[RaminExile]

Might be an unpopular opinion but I think he's a keeper. Imaginative guy - he'll use the players in the best possible way. You've got 3 safetys who happen to be your best D-Backs ? We'll use the big nickel! The D is not statistically as good as it should but a large part of that is that the offense is atrocious, and also that the entire team seems to have quit on Fisher.

 

[LACHAMP46]

That's the problem with moving Barron back to SS, though - Barron, Alexander and McD are all strong safeties. None of them are particularly well suited for FS, which is why the Big Nickel takes advantage of the current personnel on the team.

Yet our team is ranked 8th overall in passing defense.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/total/sort/netPassingYards/position/defense
http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/downs/sort/thirdDownConvs/position/defense

And really, I'm looking at the Ravens defense...worst FS in the game starting...and they have the #1 defense.
I actually think TJ is the best FS out of the bunch. Our problems in coverage are based on scheme (too much cushion) and the speed/quickness of our corners.

 

[DCH]

I know you asked Champ but I would like to ask you ...Why would you sign UFA TJ McDonald when we have so many strong safeties prospects signed on the Rams roster in 2017 already? i.e Mark Barron, Mo Alexander, Lamarcus Joyner, Blake Countess, Marqui Christian, Brian Randolph & Isaiah Johnson. Two of which have several seasons as starters in the NFL.

Let him walk? What involvement do the Rams play in this? I would expect TJ McDonald to run towards all those large contract offers from other teams. the only thing that I can think off that will keep TJ in LA is his future criminal justice issues from his early season DUI.

That's why I asked, really. I do think McDonald is the best of the bunch at SS - at Foxboro, just from the stands, he looked like the best player on either defense. Also I see Joyner as your best FS - think he's too small to reliably be a box safety and too good in coverage not to be your center fielder.

 

[DCH]

Yet our team is ranked 8th overall in passing defense.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/total/sort/netPassingYards/position/defense
http://www.espn.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/downs/sort/thirdDownConvs/position/defense

And really, I'm looking at the Ravens defense...worst FS in the game starting...and they have the #1 defense.
I actually think TJ is the best FS out of the bunch. Our problems in coverage are based on scheme (too much cushion) and the speed/quickness of our corners.

Passing D as a whole notwithstanding, I'm talking about what personnel you have in the secondary and how that would translate to a new (non-Williams non-Big Nickel) defensive style. Alexander has played better than I could have ever expected as the de facto FS; I'm not convinced he is a coverage safety going forward. I have thought for a while now that Joyner should be the FS.

My point was that you have redundancy between Barron, McD and Alexander IF Barron is moved off of the OLB position AND McD is re-signed. I point it out in large part because I really like McD's game and think the Rams would be an overall lesser defense without him than they are with.

 

[BonifayRam]

That's why I asked, really. I do think McDonald is the best of the bunch at SS - at Foxboro, just from the stands, he looked like the best player on either defense. Also I see Joyner as your best FS - think he's too small to reliably be a box safety and too good in coverage not to be your center fielder.

You would be right that when healthy TJ may be the best the Rams have has starting in the SS post since the 2007/2008 Oshiomogho Atogwe seasons. But TJ has had a ton of injury issues that resulted in 2 of his 4 seasons on the IR. When TJ was IR'd for those two seasons it was Barron & Alexander who filled in with NO loss of performance @ SS post.

TJ has pending suspension too. The other major pending outside factors coming into play with any smart interest in spending additional cap funds on an already strong fat position is Barron's seriously high cap hit & the fact that Mo Alexander is playing way out of position due to the fact that TJ has secured the SS post. Once TJ departs it would permit Mo to return to a much more natural position to fit his skills & talents. If the new DC wants Barron out of the LB'ing unit then it also provides Barron a perfect place to earn his millions. So the Rams would be in great condition @ SS post even with TJ departed.

You eluded to Lamarcus Joyner......in your post My thought here is the new DC will not want LJ starting @ the SSLB'er post like Gregg did. I would imagine rookie LB'er Josh Forrest has shown to be a good SSLB'er in his cameo plays in that post.

I also would believe chances are the new DC will seek to place LJ in the post that fits his skills & talents that he has shown in the last 3 NFL season & the four seasons On the championship FSU teams. LJ played gave FSU his best game performance while play SS & FS not CB. LJ as seen this season excels in going forward or tracking like a heat seeking missile towards the ball. What LJ does not do well is tracking & trailing a receiver. Thus LJ stands a good chance to be a legit safety prospect in 2017. Most likely @ deep free safety post that Mo Alexander has fill this season.

 

[DaveFan'51]

I think we keep Williams, Waufle , and Chuck Ceicil. I also want us to keep Mike Singletary but I'm not sure of his role. He's not listed on the present Coaching Staff List, But I know he's been acting as a " Special Assistant/ LB Coach and mentoring our MLB Ogletree!
I'm also wondering what happens to Brandon Fisher, now that Dad got the Axe!?!
OFF TOPIC Question: Will John Fassel's Dad , Jim, be attending his son's 1st game as HC!!?!

 

[A55VA6]

He gone

 

[Memento]

I'd rather cut bait with everyone except Groh, Waufle, Wilson, Fassel, and Singletary (who I'd promote to linebackers coach in a heartbeat).

 

[Mackeyser]

I think we keep Williams, Waufle , and Chuck Ceicil. I also want us to keep Mike Singletary but I'm not sure of his role. He's not listed on the present Coaching Staff List, But I know he's been acting as a " Special Assistant/ LB Coach and mentoring our MLB Ogletree!
I'm also wondering what happens to Brandon Fisher, now that Dad got the Axe!?!
OFF TOPIC Question: Will John Fassel's Dad , Jim, be attending his son's 1st game as HC!!?!
View attachment 18049

I LOVE me some Coach Bones... but dang, that smile screams, "I just crop dusted DAD! Quick take the picture before he smells it!!!"

I know... no one has to say a thing...

 

[Rmfnlt]

I'm dumping Williams....too many yards....and games against some top out of conference teams that would make a defensive guy puke.

And this is the main reason. Missed tackles, missed assignments, and STUPID penalties. Get rid of that element on the team, pronto. It will be interesting to see how many penalties we get called on the D this Thursday.

Naw...Barron can still play SS....One of the best players on our team...He's NOT a LB...and shouldn't have to continue to play one...

Agree!

 

[Mackeyser]

IF.. and this is a big IF... we had a coach who went to a 3-4, this is what I'd like to see. This presumes that Quinn is done. My respect and admiration for Quinn as a football player is super high and NONE of this is meant as disrespect to him. I'm SUPER concerned about those seizures, frankly, and I really wonder if he doesn't retire in the off-season.

LDE Easley (he's played like a beast and has a get off as fast as AD. No joke)
NT Brockers (Bit tall for NT, but he's a bull anchor and can do it)
RDE Donald (Holy Smokes. AD's get off AND the chance to bounce him between the 3,5,7 and 9 holes?)

Backups
LDE Longacre (He's an up and comer who keeps improving and making plays. Plays run and pass)
NT Thomas (Only other guy who could man NT. We'd want to upgrade this spot)
RDE Hayes (Actually think Hayes is better suited to this than 4-3 RDE at this point in his career.)

What does that mean for the LBs

ROLB Ogletree (he's at his best when he can run)
RILB Need (Bryce Hager could back up one of these spots...maybe, but we'd need some bigger guys)
LILB Need
LOLB Barron (he's a bit small, but he's a truck and his blitzing can't be underrated)

What does this mean for the back side? Well, for one, it means we won't need 47 DBs some will have to go.

 

[Memento]

IF.. and this is a big IF... we had a coach who went to a 3-4, this is what I'd like to see. This presumes that Quinn is done. My respect and admiration for Quinn as a football player is super high and NONE of this is meant as disrespect to him. I'm SUPER concerned about those seizures, frankly, and I really wonder if he doesn't retire in the off-season.

LDE Easley (he's played like a beast and has a get off as fast as AD. No joke)
NT Brockers (Bit tall for NT, but he's a bull anchor and can do it)
RDE Donald (Holy Smokes. AD's get off AND the chance to bounce him between the 3,5,7 and 9 holes?)

Backups
LDE Longacre (He's an up and comer who keeps improving and making plays. Plays run and pass)
NT Thomas (Only other guy who could man NT. We'd want to upgrade this spot)
RDE Hayes (Actually think Hayes is better suited to this than 4-3 RDE at this point in his career.)

What does that mean for the LBs

ROLB Ogletree (he's at his best when he can run)
RILB Need (Bryce Hager could back up one of these spots...maybe, but we'd need some bigger guys)
LILB Need
LOLB Barron (he's a bit small, but he's a truck and his blitzing can't be underrated)

What does this mean for the back side? Well, for one, it means we won't need 47 DBs some will have to go.

It's a good start, Mack, but I have to disagree on a few things.

Tree and Mark "The Executioner" Barron fit better on the inside, as they aren't the best pass rushers. We can find outside linebackers in free agency and the draft.

I think that Thomas is JAG, and Hayes would actually benefit from a trade. Ethan Westbrooks is a keeper at right defensive end, and we can find a backup nose tackle in the draft or in free agency.

Otherwise, I completely agree with you in this scenario. It's something I'd like to do if we're running a 3-4.

 

[Mackeyser]

Well, I did say we'd need to upgrade that backup NT position, so yeah. I agree on Thomas.

I disagree on Tree and Barron. Neither is big enough to hold up on inside power runs. That's why you had Teddy Bruschi types, the 6-4 260+ LBs who were basically of that DE/LB hybrid body type, but had LB instincts. You need that with a 3-4 because otherwise, you just run power up the gut and you got a 330 lb guard on a 225 lb Barron at the next level to spring the RB. That's not what you want. You need a LB big enough to take on and shed the block of an interior lineman which is why for 3-4 ILBs, they tend to run big.

And back in the day, when they dominated, that's why the WCO was so good...because those behemoths couldn't cover the crossing routes and go horizontal. So, crosses and slants would amount to death by a thousand cuts.

Nowadays, tho, you got ILBs of that size that CAN run...

I have plenty of faith in Tree and Barron's ability to run, cover and rush. Both are actually pretty good at it. What they aren't that good at? Taking on OL.

No matter =) The great news is that whichever D the new HC and DC brings, it should be able to best utilize our best personnel.

That's very, very good news.

 

[Adi]

This defense is top 5 on paper but they make too many mistakes, they need new leadership and someone that isn't so predictable

 

[FRO]

He's a solid DC, but he is easily replaceable.

 

[Jacobarch]

That's why I asked, really. I do think McDonald is the best of the bunch at SS - at Foxboro, just from the stands, he looked like the best player on either defense. Also I see Joyner as your best FS - think he's too small to reliably be a box safety and too good in coverage not to be your center fielder.

^^this!
Ive been saying Joyner has been playing out of position since they brought him in. He's a FS as much as the rams don't want to admit it. He played it in college and it's where he really excelled. I don't know why they keep trying to get him to play nickle cb.

 

[Ramstien]

I hope he goes I am so sick of this soft ass zone coverage.

 

[LACHAMP46]

I'm talking about what personnel you have in the secondary and how that would translate to a new (non-Williams non-Big Nickel) defensive style. Alexander has played better than I could have ever expected as the de facto FS; I'm not convinced he is a coverage safety going forward. I have thought for a while now that Joyner should be the FS.

My point was that you have redundancy between Barron, McD and Alexander IF Barron is moved off of the OLB position AND McD is re-signed. I point it out in large part because I really like McD's game and think the Rams would be an overall lesser defense without him than they are with.

the new DC will seek to place LJ in the post that fits his skills & talents that he has shown in the last 3 NFL season & the four seasons On the championship FSU teams. LJ played gave FSU his best game performance while play SS & FS not CB. LJ as seen this season excels in going forward or tracking like a heat seeking missile towards the ball. What LJ does not do well is tracking & trailing a receiver. Thus LJ stands a good chance to be a legit safety prospect in 2017.

I'm not sure where I see Joyner on this defense...FS....IDK...I also doubt we keep 3 SS....And I doubt we re-sign a departing SS contract. Just by numbers alone, I don't see a place to sign TJ Mac...
Pretty sure Joyner stays at slot corner...in his contract year.

 

[bwdenverram]

I'd personally love to see someone that runs a D like Seattle (yeah I know). Meaning more press coverage. I'm about sick of seeing us play 10 yards off when it's 3rd and 6.
We have a lot of talent on that side of the ball but it's not reached total potential. Think it's time to start fresh across the board.

 

[thirteen28]

I agree 100%, particularly without a first round pick.
Another reason I am staying in a 4/3.
Really the Rams held the Falcons
The top scoring O in the NFL to 21 points.
They held them under 300 yards of O (much of the fourth quarter was garbage time for Atlanta with Ryan on the bench) and they converted under 30% third downs.
This is with quite a few backups getting time. Williams scheme can work and he has an athletic D. Add another traditional LB or two, a DE for depth and atay 4/3.
I would try to retain Williams as well although that is not likely.

They actually got a number of 3rd down stops in the game and didn't play as bad as it looked on the scoreboard. Their first TD came off of an extremely short field due to a turnover, and two other of their scores were turnovers returned for TDs.

And let's not forget that prior to the Saints game, the Rams D was (I believe) 5th in scoring defense and 6th overall, which is incredible considering our offense is dead freakin' last or close to it in every meaningful stat. I think the Miami game broke their back though when Fisher and the O decided to sit on a 7-10 point lead for most of the game instead of really making an effort to extend the lead. The Rams D had before that held the Dolphins offense in check, and they had come into the game on a roll.

Mentally and emotionally, the D snapped in that game, and I think Fisher's fate was sealed then and there, because once the D fell apart with this O, there was no place to go but Uglyville.

I would love to see what the current D could do with a competent, if not good offense, and with a lead of a couple of TD's.